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Disappointed In Ircam Ts, Feel lied to and cheated by DontCrack Sales
JT3Jon
post Aug 14 2015, 01:03 AM
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Back in September 2014 I got word of a special introduction sale on a program called IRCAM TS and found it to be a good sounding time stretching algorithm. The interface is a bit weird and the manual was very hard to follow, but with some experimentation I got good sounding results. I only had a few days to demo as DontCrack advertised it as the following:

QUOTE
"IRCAM TS is available through-out September at the introductory price of ONLY $99 (MSRP $249)."


I was able to ask some questions at GearSlutz before purchase which can be read here: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/product-ale...pp-win-mac.html but to sum up, I was disappointed that TS could not time stretch by Tempo but only worked as multiples of the file without any relationship to BPM. For example, I cant take a loop I know is at 133bpm and time shift it to 130bpm for example. I was also a bit sad there was no way to use it as a plugin, though that was not as important. I was then told by Nick Hamilton the following:

QUOTE
The adjustments by BPM has already been listed in the improvements as well as by increments of seconds, especially for those people working in Post who need a 30 sec spot to be shrunk to 28 sec.

Yes it will be developed as a plug-in.

Right now Ircam is busy with the Windows version once it is out work will start on the plug-in version. The Windows version won't be long in coming as they are on it right now. If nothing unforeseen happens, it should be available in about 15 days.

It is early days for the TS and it will have a long life ahead of it where all the suggestions will be added to make it as useful and easy to use as possible.


Remember, all these quotes, which were instrumental in getting me to purchase the product, were made in September - October, while this supposed "intro sale $99 instead of $249" deal was going on. Well, its now been over 10 months, and we have yet to even see time adjustments by BPM, which until this happens TS is basically useless to me, seeing as how I work in music where things are tempo based. Which is fine, I dont mind waiting for this functionally and assumed as much when I purchased it in October. But then I got an email from JRRShop stating that they are now selling TS at an intro price of $79!!

So thats the straw that broke the camels back! I cant help but feel completely lied to and cheated to put down $99 back in October during this "limited time intro sale" that is STILL GOING ON!!! I thought I was invested in a limited time offer exclusively from DontCrack on software that will later cost $249! Turns out this was a LIE and had I waited, I could have gotten it 20% cheaper from JRR shop!!!

Is TS a good time stretching algorithm - YES!! But I feel 100% cheated and lied to about the product, whats "coming in the future" (still waiting on BPM support?!) and the fact that I jumped in early because I was told this was limited time deal and thought it was worth spending $99 to get in on the ground floor - yet 10 months later with NO noticeable functionality improvements, JRR shop can offer it for $79!! I feel lied to and cheated, and hope that DontCrack will do SOMETHING to make this right. Perhaps they weren't blatantly lying when they said it was a limited time intro offer thats now been going on for ALMOST A YEAR! But unless they do something to make this right, I'll be forced to assume this was done as a specific sales ploy and as such will never purchase another product from them again, and will spread the word to others that your "limited time intro offers" are a COMPLETE LIE and to simply wait for JRRshop to sell it at a lower price!!

Sorry for venting, but I really feel like I've been swindled.
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Nick
post Aug 14 2015, 02:22 PM
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QUOTE (JT3Jon @ Aug 14 2015, 02:03 AM) *
Back in September 2014 I got word of a special introduction sale on a program called IRCAM TS and found it to be a good sounding time stretching algorithm. The interface is a bit weird and the manual was very hard to follow, but with some experimentation I got good sounding results. I only had a few days to demo as DontCrack advertised it as the following:



I was able to ask some questions at GearSlutz before purchase which can be read here: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/product-ale...pp-win-mac.html but to sum up, I was disappointed that TS could not time stretch by Tempo but only worked as multiples of the file without any relationship to BPM. For example, I cant take a loop I know is at 133bpm and time shift it to 130bpm for example. I was also a bit sad there was no way to use it as a plugin, though that was not as important. I was then told by Nick Hamilton the following:



Remember, all these quotes, which were instrumental in getting me to purchase the product, were made in September - October, while this supposed "intro sale $99 instead of $249" deal was going on. Well, its now been over 10 months, and we have yet to even see time adjustments by BPM, which until this happens TS is basically useless to me, seeing as how I work in music where things are tempo based. Which is fine, I dont mind waiting for this functionally and assumed as much when I purchased it in October. But then I got an email from JRRShop stating that they are now selling TS at an intro price of $79!!

So thats the straw that broke the camels back! I cant help but feel completely lied to and cheated to put down $99 back in October during this "limited time intro sale" that is STILL GOING ON!!! I thought I was invested in a limited time offer exclusively from DontCrack on software that will later cost $249! Turns out this was a LIE and had I waited, I could have gotten it 20% cheaper from JRR shop!!!

Is TS a good time stretching algorithm - YES!! But I feel 100% cheated and lied to about the product, whats "coming in the future" (still waiting on BPM support?!) and the fact that I jumped in early because I was told this was limited time deal and thought it was worth spending $99 to get in on the ground floor - yet 10 months later with NO noticeable functionality improvements, JRR shop can offer it for $79!! I feel lied to and cheated, and hope that DontCrack will do SOMETHING to make this right. Perhaps they weren't blatantly lying when they said it was a limited time intro offer thats now been going on for ALMOST A YEAR! But unless they do something to make this right, I'll be forced to assume this was done as a specific sales ploy and as such will never purchase another product from them again, and will spread the word to others that your "limited time intro offers" are a COMPLETE LIE and to simply wait for JRRshop to sell it at a lower price!!

Sorry for venting, but I really feel like I've been swindled.


Hello JT3Jon,

Over the past three years there has been trend that plug-ins that have an MSRP price of anything from $800 to $200 are now found increasingly on 'Special Promo' of $99 or $39, a drastic price reduction.

If you are a subscriber to any of the leading Plug-in on-line stores, you will see a steady flow of newsletters listing a multitude of Monthly or even 'this week-end' or 'one day only' Promos.

And lots of people are getting caught out by this as they buy a bundle at the beginning of June at $1290, only to find out it is on sale throughout July at only $399.....

And it has created a marketplace now that only products that are on promo are selling as people rightfully do not want to get caught out paying a higher price.

So the market has changed.

The TS was launched at a special introductory price of $99 and it was the intention to end it after the first month, but due to the radical price cutting environment it has compete in the 'introductory' price was maintained until now.

We have given JRR shop and other plug-in online shops the opportunity to sell the TS at an lower price of $79 as it makes even more competitive and attractive.

With regards to the adjustment by BPM, I have had user requests for this since the first day after the launch of the product. it has been relayed to the developers and they are working on it. it is a source of frustration for me as well that it has not shown up until now.

Please send me a mail directly and I will sort something out for you.

nick@dontcrack.com

Best Regards

Nick
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JT3Jon
post Aug 14 2015, 03:51 PM
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To compare this situation with a "waves special $39 24-hour sale" is ludicrous. Because you stated TS was on an introductory sale of $99 that would END at the end of October 2014, and that it would then cost $249 after that point, I felt pressure to purchase it by the end of October. You can see that right? As that's how introductory sales work - they are limited time deals. Even IRCAM Products in the past like SPAT, products which currently cost $999, have been on sale at 50% for a month - but again this is LIMITED TIME. This is NOT why I'm upset.

I'm upset because this introductory $99 sale you said would end in October never ended, and I'm now seeing TS selling for $79 on your OWN SITE! What is this, a "20% off the introductory $99 sale" sale? IMO this is a huge slap in the face to all who purchased it at the $99 intro price. You do see this, right? I am not upset that I paid more for something - things go on sale all the time that I purchased at full price. I am upset because I feel I was pressured into purchasing back in October based on lies that it was a limited time sale, and not only has this limited time sale never stopped, its now somehow cheaper.

I have sent you an email and I look forward to a resolution of the situation.

This post has been edited by JT3Jon: Aug 14 2015, 04:04 PM
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DontCrack
post Aug 17 2015, 05:21 PM
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Hi JT3Jon,

First, please don't post the same subject in multiple threads. This a "Store" manner and so I deleted the post in the Ircam thread.

I understand your point but now days, competition is so hard that manufacturers sometimes ask us to keep promos going until the R&D cost are fully covered. At the end, you bought a great product and payed only $99 for it. The regular $249 price will be updated on September 1, as the sales have been really good and R&D almost covered...

The BPM detection is ready but they're also working on many new features requested by users and these will also be implemented in the new version.

My colleague Nick has sent you a direct email with further details.

Thank you for your patience and your understanding.

Kind Regards - Peter



--------------------
Eric Nolot
CEO / President
www.DontCrack.com
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JT3Jon
post Aug 17 2015, 10:18 PM
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QUOTE (DontCrack @ Aug 17 2015, 05:21 PM) *
Hi JT3Jon,

First, please don't post the same subject in multiple threads. This a "Store" manner and so I deleted the post in the Ircam thread.


Sorry about that. As you may have seen, I actually posted in the Ircam forums first, and then a day later realized that you have a dedicated "store" forum in which this post would make more sense. Unfortunately by that time I was no longer able to edit/delete the post in the Ircam section due to some limitation of your forum software. Normally the edit button is at the bottom right of a post, but seems to no longer be available after x amount of time. For example, I can no longer edit my original post here either. Either that or I'm missing how to do it (which is possible). Had I had the ability I would have removed the Ircam thread when I discovered and posted in your "store" section.

I appreciate you and Nicks help and understanding.

This post has been edited by JT3Jon: Aug 17 2015, 10:59 PM
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Nick
post Aug 19 2015, 12:12 PM
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QUOTE (JT3Jon @ Aug 17 2015, 11:18 PM) *
Sorry about that. As you may have seen, I actually posted in the Ircam forums first, and then a day later realized that you have a dedicated "store" forum in which this post would make more sense. Unfortunately by that time I was no longer able to edit/delete the post in the Ircam section due to some limitation of your forum software. Normally the edit button is at the bottom right of a post, but seems to no longer be available after x amount of time. For example, I can no longer edit my original post here either. Either that or I'm missing how to do it (which is possible). Had I had the ability I would have removed the Ircam thread when I discovered and posted in your "store" section.

I appreciate you and Nicks help and understanding.



Hello JT3Jon,

It is logical that you posted in the Ircam thread and then in the the Store thread, no harm done.

Peter deleted the post in the Ircam thread, so everything is fine.

As we have both said the BPM option for the adjustment of the Time compression - expansion is coming, we are sorry that it has taken so long, but it will arrive.

Best Regards,

Nick
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