Logic Hangs After Bounce, Happens only with P&M plugins Options

[radicalgel]

I have a really annoying problem with Logic Pro 9.1.8 on OSX 10.8.2. After I bounce a session I get the colour wheel of death and it never stops. Logic hangs and I have to force quit. If I disable all instances of P&M plugs in the mix I don't have this problem. I'm using Echoflex, Brightness & RetroEQ.

I have tried trashing prefs and repairing disk permission but no luck.

[radicalgel]

I have a really annoying problem with Logic Pro 9.1.8 on OSX 10.8.2. After I bounce a session I get the colour wheel of death and it never stops. Logic hangs and I have to force quit. If I disable all instances of P&M plugs in the mix I don't have this problem. I'm using Echoflex, Brightness & RetroEQ.

I have tried trashing prefs and repairing disk permission but no luck.

BUMP!! Seriously?? no one can help with this?

[radicalgel]

UPDATE: I don't think logic is hanging it's just doing something in the background thats really hogging CPU post bounce. I know this because if I just bounce a small section of the song then I don't get the spinning wheel and logic is up and running immediately. As the section becomes bigger and bigger the spinning wheel lasts longer and longer. The entire song is 5 minutes and after bouncing that I waited for over 20mins and the spinning wheel was still there so I force quit. Any idea whats going on in the background thats taking logic sooo long to recover from a bounce?

[Nick]

UPDATE: I don't think logic is hanging it's just doing something in the background thats really hogging CPU post bounce. I know this because if I just bounce a small section of the song then I don't get the spinning wheel and logic is up and running immediately. As the section becomes bigger and bigger the spinning wheel lasts longer and longer. The entire song is 5 minutes and after bouncing that I waited for over 20mins and the spinning wheel was still there so I force quit. Any idea whats going on in the background thats taking logic sooo long to recover from a bounce?

Hello radicalgel,

One suggestion would be to try to the same bounce and take out the what you think might be the most CPU intensive plug-in, but just that one.

If you have the time you might find which one may be causing the huge amount of time it takes or you might find that that Logic just wants to take its time to deliver the bounce.

How many tracks and how many effects are being used,

Best Regards,

Nick

[GeoffSix]

Hello radicalgel,

One suggestion would be to try to the same bounce and take out the what you think might be the most CPU intensive plug-in, but just that one.

If you have the time you might find which one may be causing the huge amount of time it takes or you might find that that Logic just wants to take its time to deliver the bounce.

How many tracks and how many effects are being used,

Best Regards,

Nick

Hi there,

I'm having this problem too and I've just done a little test with a few of the P&M plugins and the results are consistent for each plugin.

I started with a new project (no other plugins - totally empty) loaded a 2bar Aiff (looped to 12 bars) onto 1 track and inserted a P&M plugin. I then bounced (offline) the mix which was 18 seconds long. There was no noticeable delay after the 'offline' bounce. I then duplicated the track in multiples of four and here are my results...

4 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 4 secs delay
8 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 11 secs delay
12 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 24 secs delay
16 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 44 secs delay

The delay is between when Logic has finished the 'offline' bounce and the position pointer returns to bar 1, meaning it has completed the task.

A 'Realtime' bounce on the other hand was faultless - no delays.


I've worked on some big projects and this has never occurred until recently when I started using the P&M plugins. Regardless of project size there would never be a delay after the bounce.

I hope this is of use and can help resolve this problem as I'm using these plugins a lot now and when rendering large projects I'm now confronted with the swirling beach-ball and have had to 'Force Quit' Logic.

Cheers

Geoff

[GeoffSix]

Hi there,

I'm having this problem too and I've just done a little test with a few of the P&M plugins and the results are consistent for each plugin.

I started with a new project (no other plugins - totally empty) loaded a 2bar Aiff (looped to 12 bars) onto 1 track and inserted a P&M plugin. I then bounced (offline) the mix which was 18 seconds long. There was no noticeable delay after the 'offline' bounce. I then duplicated the track in multiples of four and here are my results...

4 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 4 secs delay
8 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 11 secs delay
12 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 24 secs delay
16 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 44 secs delay

The delay is between when Logic has finished the 'offline' bounce and the position pointer returns to bar 1, meaning it has completed the task.

A 'Realtime' bounce on the other hand was faultless - no delays.


I've worked on some big projects and this has never occurred until recently when I started using the P&M plugins. Regardless of project size there would never be a delay after the bounce.

I hope this is of use and can help resolve this problem as I'm using these plugins a lot now and when rendering large projects I'm now confronted with the swirling beach-ball and have had to 'Force Quit' Logic.

Cheers

Geoff

Just to clarify - that's one P&M plugin inserted on each track, so in the end I was using 16 plugins. I'm using an 8-core 2.4Ghz Mac Pro with 16gig Ram running OSX 10.6.8 and Logic Pro 9.1.8.

Cheers

Geoff

[GeoffSix]

Just to clarify - that's one P&M plugin inserted on each track, so in the end I was using 16 plugins. I'm using an 8-core 2.4Ghz Mac Pro with 16gig Ram running OSX 10.6.8 and Logic Pro 9.1.8.

Cheers

Geoff

For further clarification Logic was running in 64bit mode. In 32bit mode 16 tracks with 1 plugin on each track resulted in a delay of 30 secs after an offline bounce.

Cheers

Geoff

[Nick]

Hi there,

I'm having this problem too and I've just done a little test with a few of the P&M plugins and the results are consistent for each plugin.

I started with a new project (no other plugins - totally empty) loaded a 2bar Aiff (looped to 12 bars) onto 1 track and inserted a P&M plugin. I then bounced (offline) the mix which was 18 seconds long. There was no noticeable delay after the 'offline' bounce. I then duplicated the track in multiples of four and here are my results...

4 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 4 secs delay
8 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 11 secs delay
12 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 24 secs delay
16 tracks with 1 P&M plugin inserted - 44 secs delay

The delay is between when Logic has finished the 'offline' bounce and the position pointer returns to bar 1, meaning it has completed the task.

A 'Realtime' bounce on the other hand was faultless - no delays.


I've worked on some big projects and this has never occurred until recently when I started using the P&M plugins. Regardless of project size there would never be a delay after the bounce.

I hope this is of use and can help resolve this problem as I'm using these plugins a lot now and when rendering large projects I'm now confronted with the swirling beach-ball and have had to 'Force Quit' Logic.

Cheers

Geoff

Hello Geoff,

A 'Realtime' bounce on the other hand was faultless - no delays. When the bounce was "offline" then you get the long lapses of time before Logic can finish.

As a ProTools user myself, I am used to only bouncing in 'Realtime'. "Offline" bouncing within Logic accelerates the process and can result in errors, there are quite a few reports on their forums.

"I've not noticed problems with delays or fades or anything else when using Logic's own plug-ins.

However I did notice two things when offline bouncing:

1) Automation timing may be slightly off compared to realtime (=earlier)
2) Some 3rd party plug-ins such as Antares Auto-Tune EVO can act up"

"For me the Real Time Bounce is more reliable than Offline. Sometimes it even happens if i have Magma inserted on a track i choose to freeze, and i suppose that makes sense. If i really want to use Magma, i almost always opt for Real Time bouncing now, and at the end of the Bounce process i've found i need to be a bit patient and not try to make my computer do anything for a little while. Not Play or return to the top or switch apps or anything. That seems to make it angry too"


"Re: Bounce using Waves Plug-in goes on eternally w/out stopp
by n6smith » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:05 pm

Does having "Add Effect Tail" box checked have anything to do with this problem?


Yes.. Some plugins can cause the effect you are seeing where the tail never ends... even though it become inaudible.. so try with it unchecked..

You might need to lengthen the last set of regions in your project to take account of the audible tail of the effects that you can actually hear... A little experimentation with region / tail lengths.. will go a long way to working out what works best for you, with any given plugin / FX setting."

As I can see from your investigations, the fact that there are Plug & Mix plug-ins present in the mix adds quite a bit of extra time to complete the "offline" bounce, but looking at the Logic forums we don't seem to be alone in adding to time Logic takes to calculate the bounce. A bit surprising as the Plug-ins are very CPU usage friendly, unlike some of the others who cause the same sort of problems.

IMHO "realtime" seems to be a guarantee of a successful and true representation of the mix you are working on.

Best Regards,

Nick

[GeoffSix]

Hello Geoff,

A 'Realtime' bounce on the other hand was faultless - no delays. When the bounce was "offline" then you get the long lapses of time before Logic can finish.

As a ProTools user myself, I am used to only bouncing in 'Realtime'. "Offline" bouncing within Logic accelerates the process and can result in errors, there are quite a few reports on their forums.

"I've not noticed problems with delays or fades or anything else when using Logic's own plug-ins.

However I did notice two things when offline bouncing:

1) Automation timing may be slightly off compared to realtime (=earlier)
2) Some 3rd party plug-ins such as Antares Auto-Tune EVO can act up"

"For me the Real Time Bounce is more reliable than Offline. Sometimes it even happens if i have Magma inserted on a track i choose to freeze, and i suppose that makes sense. If i really want to use Magma, i almost always opt for Real Time bouncing now, and at the end of the Bounce process i've found i need to be a bit patient and not try to make my computer do anything for a little while. Not Play or return to the top or switch apps or anything. That seems to make it angry too"


"Re: Bounce using Waves Plug-in goes on eternally w/out stopp
by n6smith » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:05 pm

Does having "Add Effect Tail" box checked have anything to do with this problem?


Yes.. Some plugins can cause the effect you are seeing where the tail never ends... even though it become inaudible.. so try with it unchecked..

You might need to lengthen the last set of regions in your project to take account of the audible tail of the effects that you can actually hear... A little experimentation with region / tail lengths.. will go a long way to working out what works best for you, with any given plugin / FX setting."

As I can see from your investigations, the fact that there are Plug & Mix plug-ins present in the mix adds quite a bit of extra time to complete the "offline" bounce, but looking at the Logic forums we don't seem to be alone in adding to time Logic takes to calculate the bounce. A bit surprising as the Plug-ins are very CPU usage friendly, unlike some of the others who cause the same sort of problems.

IMHO "realtime" seems to be a guarantee of a successful and true representation of the mix you are working on.

Best Regards,

Nick

Hi Nick,

thanks for the reply but are you saying that the P&M plugins are not at fault? As I stated, this has never occurred in all the years I've been using Logic with other 3rd party software and doing offline bounces without any problems, only now since using the P&M plugins has this problem arisen and in my opinion makes them less desirable to use.

Do you still plan to investigate the problem?

Regards

Geoff

[Nick]

Hi Nick,

thanks for the reply but are you saying that the P&M plugins are not at fault? As I stated, this has never occurred in all the years I've been using Logic with other 3rd party software and doing offline bounces without any problems, only now since using the P&M plugins has this problem arisen and in my opinion makes them less desirable to use.

Do you still plan to investigate the problem?

Regards

Geoff

Hello Geoff,

The fact that you can't do what you can with other company's plug-ins means we are at fault. My point was we are not alone is working on correcting this. It can be very complex to sort out sometimes as there are a mulitude of different variations in the set-up people are using, OS, DAW version, other plug-ins.


Best Regards,

Nick

[GeoffSix]

Hello Geoff,

The fact that you can't do what you can with other company's plug-ins means we are at fault. My point was we are not alone is working on correcting this. It can be very complex to sort out sometimes as there are a mulitude of different variations in the set-up people are using, OS, DAW version, other plug-ins.


Best Regards,

Nick

Hi Nick,

thanks for clarifying that.

I appreciate it's difficult to pin point the problem and that's why in my test above I used nothing but P&M plugins, so at least you know it's not a conflict with any other plugins.

Best Regards

Geoff

[djjacobtodd]

Hi There,

This is happening to me as well, is there any update on a fix? I love these plugins but this issue is starting to drive me nuts!

Thanks!

[Nick]

Hi There,

This is happening to me as well, is there any update on a fix? I love these plugins but this issue is starting to drive me nuts!

Thanks!

Hello djjacobtodd,

My guess is that you are referring to the "off-line" bounce, right?

As I have said in the previous posts it seems to be due to the amount of CPU power that has to be used when using this function with the P&M plug-ins.

We are working on it, but I don't have any date to tell you right now when it will be working better.

Out of curiosity has anyone tried it with the new logic X?

Best Regards,

Nick

[djjacobtodd]

Yes, I'm having problems with Logic hanging with the offline bounce.

What are some of your most CPU intensive plugins?

[Nick]

Yes, I'm having problems with Logic hanging with the offline bounce.

What are some of your most CPU intensive plugins?

Hello djjacobtodd,

Is it with Logic 9 or the new Logic X?

Best Regards,

Nick