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New Prices - Huh?
Dfakt
post May 1 2011, 11:12 AM
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am I imagining things ?
the current price for the GRM v3 collection is now:
list price: $800
dontcrack.com: $689


From the introductory offer I was under the distinct impression it would be a list price of $1,150, what with that figure being in the headline of the offer.. 'n stuff.


were we misled into buying too early (a beta?) ?
I know for the sake of saving $200 I would not have gone to the extraordinary lengths I went to in order to raise the cash on time, nor would I have done it for the 'privilege' of being an early-adopter....


so someone tell me I'm imagining things please blink.gif
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oivindi
post May 1 2011, 06:06 PM
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Yeah, this is pretty interesting.

Says $1150 msrp right here:

http://store.dontcrack.com/product_info.php?products_id=799

But if you click on to the complete collection, it seems the retail price is suddenly $800? Which has again been slashed to $689?

http://store.dontcrack.com/product_info.php?products_id=800

This is pretty interesting from an upgrade perspective. I bought the complete collection for $489 even though I already have Grm Tools v2. If upgrade prices now turn out to be (significantly) lower than $489 from v2 to v3, I will be pretty ... well, I am sure you can imagine what I will be.
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Dfakt
post May 1 2011, 09:38 PM
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If you only wanted to upgrade the Classic/Spectral Transform suites you should have waited for those individual upgrades instead of buying the new complete package, which includes a third suite - 'evolution'.

they advertised a bundle for what appeared to be 42% of the list price. What we've now discovered is that we've paid 61% of the list price.

going by the discounted prices offered at their store, to be early-adopters and for offering a quick cash injection we're only saving $200 on the bundle price when it appeared we would be saving more like $500.


I'd like to see someone explain this.
This is very shady pricing shenanigans.
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javahut
post May 1 2011, 10:10 PM
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Yep, more than a little off-putting. Means I won't be buying much else (anything) from Don't Crack again.
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Dfakt
post May 4 2011, 10:31 PM
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QUOTE (oivindi @ May 1 2011, 06:06 PM) *
Yeah, this is pretty interesting.

Says $1150 msrp right here:

http://store.dontcrack.com/product_info.php?products_id=799



QUOTE (javahut @ May 1 2011, 10:10 PM) *
Yep, more than a little off-putting. Means I won't be buying much else (anything) from Don't Crack again.



they've changed/erased any mention of the list price from that link.
That's why screen-capture was invented I guess.

PETER has been posting on KVR today promoting the latest sale, but doesn't have a minute to deal with this issue.

what a class act.

anyone know who you report these kind of fraudulent promotions to ? in canada ?
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Dfakt
post May 4 2011, 10:48 PM
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we were presented with a price that amounted to 42% of the msrp $1,150 ... which is $489.
but now we discover the msrp is really $800.
not the deal we were advertised.

42% of $800 = $336

$489 - $336 = $153

we are owed $153 in change.
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DontCrack
post May 6 2011, 01:23 PM
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Dear friends,

We understand your concerns but please take the following under consideration :

When ina GRM asked us to take over the distribution of GRM Tools products, there was no such thing as a complete GRM Tools collection. They had the original "Classic" and "Spectral Tranform" bundles and the new "Evolution bundle".

These were planned to be sold at net prices of $400 for the classic and the ST and $500 for the new "Evolution Bundle" which would have been $1300 for all GRM products. These were more or less the prices before we took over and you only had the VST or the RTAS for that price (not talking about the TDM prices)...

From there we talked our friends at ina GRM into making their products available to a wider range of customers suggesting to sell the the "Classic" and "ST" at MSRP $350 and the new "Evolution" at $450 which is MSRP $1150 for the total package.

From there we talked ina GRM into promoting a "total package" with a single installer and activation code with an attractive introductory offer of only $489 which has been pretty tough to negotiate. The only reason why they accepted that deal is because the upgrade paths were not available (and are still not) and we wanted to make an attractive offer to previous owners at cheaper price than through future upgrades which will be $99 for each Classic and ST + Evolution at $450 which will be $648 to fully upgrade with the Evolution bundle ! Yes all of that is quite complicated and yes it is difficult to please everyone :-/

As the promotion did very well (and we thank all of you for that) ina GRM asked us to keep the "Complete Bundle" live for regular distribution. As you'll understand, we couldn't simply make that complete bundle available for the regular price of MSRP $1150 which is the simple addition of the 3 bundles ($350 + $350 + $450 = $1150).

Moreover, we negotiated to sell GRM products at MAP prices with +/- 20% discount which pulls the prices down at $289 for the Classic and ST bundles and $389 for the Evolution bundle which is $967 at MAP price for the total bundle.

That's how we ended up suggesting to sell the "Complete Bundle" at MSRP $800 and MAP at $689 ! All of you that paid $489 for that bundle did get a really good price... We understand that might sound like dirty marketing techniques but at the end we didn't mean to fool anyone. I mean anyone will understand that the regular price announced for the complete bundle at $1150 was simply the addition of all 3 bundles and can expect to see that complete bundle offered at a better price than simply buying all 3 bundles individually, right ?

I think it belongs to customers to appreciate how good a promotion can be and what is a good price for a certain product. I truly believe we did a great job making the GRM Tools products available at such low prices which wasn't planed at all when we started negotiations with the folks at ina GRM...

If you look at it, all of you that paid $489 for the complete GRM Pack which contains 15 plug-ins paid ONLY $32.60 for each of these hi quality plug-ins... I don't think we could have brought a better deal what ever the MSRP price is or will be in the future and that's what really counts at the end doesn't it ?

I hope that answers your thoughts and that you'll appreciate our efforts negotiating good deals to our loyal customers.

Thanks for your consideration and your understanding.

Kind Regards - Peter


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Eric Nolot
CEO / President
www.DontCrack.com
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Neon Breath
post May 7 2011, 12:52 AM
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Wow, some people no matter what will never, ever be happy blink.gif

Well I guess then I'm the only one here who is really happy with the deal I made and glad to have all the GRM plugins for only $489.


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javahut
post May 7 2011, 05:09 AM
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QUOTE (DontCrack @ May 6 2011, 02:23 PM) *
That's how we ended up suggesting to sell the "Complete Bundle" at MSRP $800 and MAP at $689 ! All of you that paid $489 for that bundle did get a really good price... We understand that might sound like dirty marketing techniques but at the end we didn't mean to fool anyone. I mean anyone will understand that the regular price announced for the complete bundle at $1150 was simply the addition of all 3 bundles and can expect to see that complete bundle offered at a better price than simply buying all 3 bundles individually, right ?

If you look at it, all of you that paid $489 for the complete GRM Pack which contains 15 plug-ins paid ONLY $32.60 for each of these hi quality plug-ins... I don't think we could have brought a better deal what ever the MSRP price is or will be in the future and that's what really counts at the end doesn't it ?

I, too, am completely happy with the deal, the product, and the price.

However, you did call it a "bundle" at the time of purchase. I think most people would think it's reasonable to assume that if you're selling it as a "bundle", making it a point that the complete "bundle" costs a specific price in your selling campaign, and that it's a limited time offer to save a certain amount of money... then once the limited time is up, that's what the price will be.

This wasn't a case of "whatever the price will be in the future". The price and savings alluded to in the intro offer was changed immediately after the "limited time" was up. You have to admit, from the outside, it looks shady, and like a sales pitch to suck customers in while you can.

I'm actually all for the MSRP being lower, as I thought it being so high to begin with, it might not attract as many buyers, and would make the product less profitable for ina-GRM to keep updated and keep up further development.

But I really don't see how you could not expect telling customers a product costs $1150, and for a limited time only you can get it for $489... making the customer think if they don't buy now, it's gonna cost them almost $700 more after the limited time... then dropping the price immediately after the limited time so the customer only really saved $200... would not look in some way like a sales scheme. You can't really not expect that. And that is what it looks like, whether intentional or not.
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MiroslavH
post May 31 2011, 10:39 PM
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I must confess that I've decided to write a text as acidic as that of colleagues. I'm owner of the GRM Tools from the 1.0 version. However after reading your explanation (Thank You), I significantly revised my position. Your letter took me back to remind me naked reality: the French are often considered the worst dealers in the world of all time! When I learned that your company will now ensure the distribution of GRM Tools, I thought: Finally we will be facing a solid and logical commercial policy. Because before - better not worth talking!

In the small world of plugins, we can see that certain products, often technically and ergonomically excellent are killed by an incredibly bad trade policy of the editor.

In general, if the application exists for many DAW and / or platforms PC / Mac, the product is supplied in all its versions. The advantage, if the customer changes DAW or computer, it installs the correct version in the correct format on the right platform and is happy!

Some publishers - and INA GRM first - are so stingy and greedy of money, they create numerous versions, hoping to milk the cash cow until they bleed! You changed DAW? Punishment! Buy all your new plugins: with the old, you can wipe it behind you! You pass from Mac to PC? Punishment yet!! And it's Occastions to make money again! A new version (because the old isn't so perfect)? Super punishment with the whip and cane like extra attention of the house! You will pay the new, as if the former had never existed!

It is no coincidence that France's Marquis de Sade worships with his whips and diarrhea candy!

With dynamical trade policy of Don't Krack, we can see smart companies who understand that it is better to sell 10,000 copies of the product with 80% like 150 for full price. And because I've lived long in France, and because I worked with the French, I guess, how the negotiations should be difficult (and chaotic) with people INA GRM: do not forget it is a subsidized institution whose privileged have never had to use a business intelligence.

So I decided to arm myself patience and wait for the results of negotiations of our friends from Don't Krack. Especially since I'm already punished twice: once from version 1 to 2 (Splaash), and another by changing the platform (Woooosh). Mon portemonnaie tremble encore lorsque je pronnonce devant lui le nom de INA GRM!

And I wish you success! I know how hard it is!!

At end: a small suggestion: Please tell your "friends" of the INA GRM, your trade policy helps ensure that customers are not looking too cross-eyed side of certain Russian sites, on which all goods prices are only the download. I have not yet seen GRM Tools here, but with a so crappy policy, they will not appear there soon !!!!!
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MiroslavH
post May 31 2011, 10:47 PM
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QUOTE (MiroslavH @ May 31 2011, 10:39 PM) *
I must confess that


The same, in french. You can use it in your relation with GRM.
-----------
Je dois avouer que j'avais décidé d'écrire un texte aussi acide que celui des collègues. J'utilise GRM Tools depuis sa version 1.0. Toutefois après la lecture de votre explication (Merci), j'ai sensiblement revisé ma position. Votre lettre m'a ramené à me rappeler une réalité nue: les Français sont souvent considérés comme les pires commerçants du monde de tous les temps! Lorsque j'ai appris que c'est votre société qui va désormais assurer la distribution du GRM Tools, je me suis dit: Enfin on sera en face d'une logique commerciale acceptable. Car avant - mieux vaux ne pas en parler!

Dans le petit monde des plugins, on a la possibilité de comparer et on voit que certains produits, souvent excellents sur le plan technique ou ergonomique se font tuer par une politique commerciale incroyablement mauvaise.

En général, si l'application existe pour plusieurs DAW et/ou plateformes PC/Mac, le produit est fourni sous toutes ses versions. L'avantage, si le client change de DAW, ou d'ordinateur, il installe la bonne version au bon format sur la bonne plateforme et il est bien content!

Certains éditeurs - et INA GRM en premier - sont tellement pingres et avides du fric, qu'ils créent des versions nombreuses, espérant de traire la vache à lait jusqu'au sang! Tu a changé de DAW? Punition! Achète tous tes plugins neufs: avec les vieux, tu peux te torcher le derrière! Tu passe du Mac au PC? Punition encore!!!! Et c'est l'occasion de faire du fric encore! On sort une nouvelle version? Super punition avec fouet et canne en supplément comme attention de la maison! Vous allez payer la nouvelle, comme si l'ancienne n'avait jamais existé!!

Ce n'est pas par hasard que la France vénère son Marquis de Sade avec ses des fouets et bonbons à diarrhées!

Grâce à la politique commerciale intelligente de Don't Krack, nous pouvons voir les sociétés intelligentes qui ont compris qu'il vaut mieux vendre 10000 exemplaires du produit avec 80% de réduction que 150 à plein prix. Et parce que j'ai vécu longtemps en France, et parce que j'ai travaillé avec les Français, j'imagine, à quel point les négociations doivent être difficiles (et chaotiques) avec les gens d'INA GRM: n'oublions pas que c'est une institution subventionnée dont les privilégiés n'ont jamais dû faire preuve d'une intelligence commerciale.

Donc j'ai décidé de m'armer de patience et attendre le résultats des négociations de nos amis de Don't Krack. Surtout que je me suis fait déjà punir deux fois: une fois en passant de la version 1 vers la 2, et une autre en changeant la plateforme. Mon portemonnaie tremble encore lorsque je prononce devant lui le nom de INA GRM!

Et je vous souhaite de réussir! je sais à quel point cela est difficile!!!!

Et pour finir, une petite suggestion: dites SVP à vos "amis" de l'INA GRM, que votre politique commerciale contribue à ce que les clients ne cherchent pas trop à loucher du côté des sites russes, sur lesquels tous ces produits se trouvent aux prix de téléchargement. Je n'y ai pas encore vu GRM Tools, mais avec une politique aussi merdique, ils ne vont pas tarder à y apparaître!!!!!

This post has been edited by MiroslavH: May 31 2011, 10:51 PM
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Loopy C
post Jun 2 2011, 02:01 AM
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QUOTE (Neon Breath @ May 6 2011, 04:52 PM) *
Wow, some people no matter what will never, ever be happy blink.gif

Well I guess then I'm the only one here who is really happy with the deal I made and glad to have all the GRM plugins for only $489.


No, not the only one ;-) I got LOTS great and unique software for a great price...only happiness and creativity here biggrin.gif There were some glitches (as with most new products as they encounter every manner of OS/hardware/DAW combination imaginable) but progress has been good in ironing these out (thanks Emmanuel at GRM).


--------------------
Chris R. Gibson | GRM 3.0 Complete
MacBook Pro 2.8 Ghz (Mid 2010) | 8 GB RAM | OSX 10.6.8 | Logic 9.1.3
Mac Pro 2.66 Ghz (Nehalem 8 Core) | 16 GB RAM | OSX 10.8.5 | Logic 9.1.8
MacBook Pro 2.4 Ghz Core 2 Duo | 2 GB RAM | OSX 10.9.3 | Logic X
iPad GEN 3 | 60 GB | IOS 7.1.1
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