P&m Plug-ins Bug Reports, Please report bugs or any kind of problems using DC V.I.P. Plug-ins Options

[WorldStudios]

Why don't you answer our question about the installer not working?

[airwavemusic]

I've been through the very same stuff but it's working here, even when it says install failed, I installed p&m VIP bundle manually and it seems to work even though the message said, installation failed.
Now the list of glitches, bugs and problems I've come across while testing this one is just incredible. As usual with any plug-in from either P&M or Nomad Factory as they share some of the same code and technology, I've been through the same nightmare with a sensibly similar product called Magma. It never worked properly and I took them 8 or 9 updates to make it more or less usable. Still today I get regular glitches, plops, audio drop-outs with it all the time, on top its filters are responding too slowly to automation so they're unusable.

Here's a short list of what's going on in logic 10.1.1 on a mac os 10.9

1) The host automation is ETREMELY slow. E.G. I want to open the logic list on my track to select a parameter, and it gives me rainbow wheel for almost 30 secs EACH TIME I click on it. 2000 of parameters is maybe too much guys. It's a horrible coding mistake. 512 parameter slots as in reaktor or Guitar rig would have been enough.

2) The host automation doesn't show up the NAME of the parameter, you just see numbers in Logic, and each thine I have to open the plug-in window.
3) The displayed info is very slow, in fact it completely slows down my refresh rate on this computer, a Macbook Pro Retina 2013 with an Nvidia 750 chip (and it's running on that one). I mean everything slows down, logic, the plug-in and anything related to them.
4) Realtime Automation seems impossible to do properly as when turning knobs it keeps hanging. Remember when computers were too slow to play a specific game, the refresh rate slows down and makes your game unplayable? so I get scaled automation, which is not only what I want to avoid, but an absolute time-eater.
5) Opening any Plug&mix separately from the chainer afterwards to compare behavior, gives me the same problem, automation glitches, and I even have to restart my computer completely to get it working normally again.

My conclusion is that while I LOVE using the plug&mix effects in my productions, and I'm a huge clarisonix, limiter, echo flex, and talking tone addict, if anything from the same team is glitchy all the time, it doesn't surprise me that media don't talk about it. What a bad advertising for you guys, again and again.

In 2015 it's absolutely unacceptable to have plugins that give so many glitches and issues as yours when they get released. I'm sorry to say that, because every single production I've done in the last 2 years makes heavy use of your stuff and you deserve top rating and credit.

I contacted eric on Facebook, but he didn't seem to be active on there.

[airwavemusic]

After a few quick tests in Ableton Live 9 (32 bits) I can more or less say that only the Audiounit plugins are affected. Once I put the VST plugins instead, everything seems to be fine and running.

[kevaquarian]

I've been through the very same stuff but it's working here, even when it says install failed, I installed p&m VIP bundle manually and it seems to work even though the message said, installation failed.
Now the list of glitches, bugs and problems I've come across while testing this one is just incredible. As usual with any plug-in from either P&M or Nomad Factory as they share some of the same code and technology, I've been through the same nightmare with a sensibly similar product called Magma. It never worked properly and I took them 8 or 9 updates to make it more or less usable. Still today I get regular glitches, plops, audio drop-outs with it all the time, on top its filters are responding too slowly to automation so they're unusable.

Here's a short list of what's going on in logic 10.1.1 on a mac os 10.9

1) The host automation is ETREMELY slow. E.G. I want to open the logic list on my track to select a parameter, and it gives me rainbow wheel for almost 30 secs EACH TIME I click on it. 2000 of parameters is maybe too much guys. It's a horrible coding mistake. 512 parameter slots as in reaktor or Guitar rig would have been enough.

2) The host automation doesn't show up the NAME of the parameter, you just see numbers in Logic, and each thine I have to open the plug-in window.
3) The displayed info is very slow, in fact it completely slows down my refresh rate on this computer, a Macbook Pro Retina 2013 with an Nvidia 750 chip (and it's running on that one). I mean everything slows down, logic, the plug-in and anything related to them.
4) Realtime Automation seems impossible to do properly as when turning knobs it keeps hanging. Remember when computers were too slow to play a specific game, the refresh rate slows down and makes your game unplayable? so I get scaled automation, which is not only what I want to avoid, but an absolute time-eater.
5) Opening any Plug&mix separately from the chainer afterwards to compare behavior, gives me the same problem, automation glitches, and I even have to restart my computer completely to get it working normally again.

My conclusion is that while I LOVE using the plug&mix effects in my productions, and I'm a huge clarisonix, limiter, echo flex, and talking tone addict, if anything from the same team is glitchy all the time, it doesn't surprise me that media don't talk about it. What a bad advertising for you guys, again and again.

In 2015 it's absolutely unacceptable to have plugins that give so many glitches and issues as yours when they get released. I'm sorry to say that, because every single production I've done in the last 2 years makes heavy use of your stuff and you deserve top rating and credit.

I contacted eric on Facebook, but he didn't seem to be active on there.

Hmmmm.... I didn't know that the code for the PnM plugz had some crossover with Nomad Factory code. This does not surprise me though. I had a total NIGHTMARE with hours and hours of lost studio time trying to "troubleshoot" what was basically flaky code in the NF Integral Pack. I was told I was "the only person with problems". I personally knew of 5 other composers who had the same problems I did and the internet fiorums revealed many more than that. All my posts got mysteriously "removed" for the NF forum - I wonder why?.....

It took years overall and still I can't trust the plugins to behave 100% reliably in my professional projects. I tested Magma a few times with different updates, and that was flaky too - crashes and hangs etc. I will not be buying it, even though I would use it if it was stable.

I do hope that the PnM stuff will recover from the bugs etc - I like some of the plugins a lot and really want to use them in projects. However, I cannot risk down time on deadline studio projects for commissions, so I'm wary.....

I also have Automation sluggishness/accuracy issues - with Degradiator - just discovered today.

I have the PnM collection installed and I'm using it with care and attention to fragility issues. I've not installed Chainer, and won't do so until I see updates that address the problems being reported here.

[masterj]

vsti's (in protools" are not working properly, i mean they load, but try laying down stuff on the piano roll editor, it gives out no signal

[airwavemusic]

okay after a second bunch of tests and a complete clean of my caches with onyx, a perm repair, etc...

What I did:

Compare P&M chainer fx automation behavior vs fx behavior in Logic, Live
Compare P&M Chainer fx auto behavior vs Magma fx auto behavior in Logic
Compare P&M effects (without chainer then) VST vs AU automation behavior.
Compare Chainer mouse automation (by dragging knobs on the screen) vs CC automation via Smart Controls and a Dedicated midi cc

To sum it up a bit:

1) VST doesn't seem to eat as much resource as AU does (and it only applies to Nomad Factory and P&M plugins), once closed the graphics go back to normal framerate
2) The AU chainer seems not to deal in time with the data sent to it by using a mouse which means an awful scale effect in the resulting automation when recording auto with a mouse, while other AU plugins give much better resolution, and logic's have max resolution.
3) The AU chainer responds efficiently when using midi CC, as if I was using logic effects, and this is the most surprising thing, it looks like the p&m and nomad factory software is too heavy for my graphics card.
4) The Chainer parameters remain definitely impersonal (param 0, param 1) which is quite unpractical,
5) The Chainer parameter list for automation is way too long and might freeze logic completely.
6) The AU and VST plugins contained in the Chainer installer will NOT install and the installer will give an error message. To solve the issue, P&M users can download both VST and AU 3.3 versions of the VIP bundle on the plugandmix.com website. Once installed, depending on the AU or VST version, plug-ins should show up into the Chainer.

[DontCrack]

Hello folks,

Ok we've been investigating the issues listed above. It comes out that very little issues could be reproduced. We therefore need very precise information when reporting issues :

Machine model
OS system
DAW version(s)
Which VST plug-ins crash
Etc.

But most of all, send precise information so that we can systematically reproduce the bug. Like which VST crashes. We have tested tones of them but...

Now to answer the issues where some of you encounter "Installation Failed", that is most likely a "Permission" issue where the installer is not able to create all folders in the library, specially the P&M plugin folder. The first thing to do is "Repair Permissions" relaunch and re-install the chainer.

It also looks like you may ignore the message. Simply launch the chainer from your DAW and Re-Scan the plugins from the PREFS menu on the Chainer Gui... That should do it as well but repairing permissions is always the best option when installers fail to create folders on the system!

Those who encounter issues using controller hardware with infinite rotating buttons such as Avid command 8 should download the latest P&M plugins version 3.3.

We are actively working on reproducing issues on Logic and pro tools as reported but things work fine here... Automation can be tricky but that is an other story and we are monitoring your feedback to solve particular issues ASAP.

At last, please note that our servers have been heating up these past days with hundreds of downloads per hour. So if you encounter download issues, please be a little patient, things will shortly calm down.

Thank you all for your time reporting things. We are working hard to fix things when we can reproduce them.

Kind Regards - Eric

[DontCrack]

Just an other comment concerning the "Installation Failed" issue.

Again repairing the "Permissions" from the disk utility should do it but...

You may also have a look at :

Disk/Library/Application Support/Plug and Mix/PM Chainer/PM Plug-Ins

If the last folder "PM Plug-Ins" doesn't exist, it is a Script problem likely due to Permissions "write" limitations.

You may manually create the folder named exactly "PM Plug-Ins" and relaunch the installer.

All 45 P&M proprietary plugins (.pmplugins) should reside in that folder.

Hope this helps - Eric

[DontCrack]

I've been through the very same stuff but it's working here, even when it says install failed, I installed p&m VIP bundle manually and it seems to work even though the message said, installation failed.
Now the list of glitches, bugs and problems I've come across while testing this one is just incredible. As usual with any plug-in from either P&M or Nomad Factory as they share some of the same code and technology, I've been through the same nightmare with a sensibly similar product called Magma. It never worked properly and I took them 8 or 9 updates to make it more or less usable. Still today I get regular glitches, plops, audio drop-outs with it all the time, on top its filters are responding too slowly to automation so they're unusable.

Here's a short list of what's going on in logic 10.1.1 on a mac os 10.9

1) The host automation is ETREMELY slow. E.G. I want to open the logic list on my track to select a parameter, and it gives me rainbow wheel for almost 30 secs EACH TIME I click on it. 2000 of parameters is maybe too much guys. It's a horrible coding mistake. 512 parameter slots as in reaktor or Guitar rig would have been enough.

2) The host automation doesn't show up the NAME of the parameter, you just see numbers in Logic, and each thine I have to open the plug-in window.
3) The displayed info is very slow, in fact it completely slows down my refresh rate on this computer, a Macbook Pro Retina 2013 with an Nvidia 750 chip (and it's running on that one). I mean everything slows down, logic, the plug-in and anything related to them.
4) Realtime Automation seems impossible to do properly as when turning knobs it keeps hanging. Remember when computers were too slow to play a specific game, the refresh rate slows down and makes your game unplayable? so I get scaled automation, which is not only what I want to avoid, but an absolute time-eater.
5) Opening any Plug&mix separately from the chainer afterwards to compare behavior, gives me the same problem, automation glitches, and I even have to restart my computer completely to get it working normally again.

My conclusion is that while I LOVE using the plug&mix effects in my productions, and I'm a huge clarisonix, limiter, echo flex, and talking tone addict, if anything from the same team is glitchy all the time, it doesn't surprise me that media don't talk about it. What a bad advertising for you guys, again and again.

In 2015 it's absolutely unacceptable to have plugins that give so many glitches and issues as yours when they get released. I'm sorry to say that, because every single production I've done in the last 2 years makes heavy use of your stuff and you deserve top rating and credit.

I contacted eric on Facebook, but he didn't seem to be active on there.

Hello airwavemusic,

Thanks for your post

Here is a capture of the automation parameters that we loaded on a slot that contains a Fabfilter plugin. Many manufacturers have way more than 500 automation controls :/

Now the automation shows the parameter names has expected.
Logic Automation

As mentioned above, we are investigating all reports but it sure isn't easy if we don't have the exact same configuration as users...

Thank you - Eric

[airwavemusic]

hi eric, I'm glad you are responding quickly on that one, and I'd be glad to help.

Thanks for clarifying the permissions issue, it's indeed quite common but it's a well known OSX bug, until 10.10.3 at least. At least it works that way too. I did repair my permissions earlier today, and we should all try again then.

You're absolutely right, the parameters show up correctly and as expected inside Chainer. But not into Logic pro. When I enable Host Autmation into Omnisphere for example, the actual name, or at least a shortened version, shows up in the automation parameters into logic. The same goes for every single plugin, except for Chainer and... Magma MFX. The latter features 1000 host id's and is therefore a bit less glitchy. Logic has some issues handling too many automation parameters. Fact is, none of the other effects I have give me issues every single time I click on the automation sub-menu, not even magma, and that means most of the time that it's either a graphics issue or that it's having trouble handling those params (and I'd go for the latter, because when the plug-in window is closed, it does the same anyway). A rainbow wheel every 30 secs with a list of thousands of param 0XXX isn't very pleasing to work with if you see what I mean, and hopefully you do.

It looks like Spectrasonics (to some extent), Nomad Factory, and DC are using the same host ID system. The question is now, how can we make sure they work the same way?? In the case of Spectrasonics, it works flawlessly. In the case of magma and plug&mix Chainer, it looks like it's a bit different. Omnisphere and Trillian feature 256 automation slots for the host automation, and in most cases, it's more than enough! That's just my point here. Giving access to thousands of parameters in the automation isn't absolutely necessary in most cases, but that's an open debate.

Anyway, if you need screenshots, or even better, video capture of what happens, It's not a problem for me to show you. Keep me updated.

Quick Update: The Installer works as expected after a repair disk, repair permissions, and an audio unit cache cleanup courtesy of onyx.


This post has been edited by airwavemusic: Mar 28 2015, 08:40 PM

[4lyna]

When I enable Host Autmation into Omnisphere for example, the actual name, or at least a shortened version, shows up in the automation parameters into logic. The same goes for every single plugin, except for Chainer and... Magma MFX. The latter features 1000 host id's and is therefore a bit less glitchy. Logic has some issues handling too many automation parameters. Fact is, none of the other effects I have give me issues every single time I click on the automation sub-menu, not even magma, and that means most of the time that it's either a graphics issue or that it's having trouble handling those params (and I'd go for the latter, because when the plug-in window is closed, it does the same anyway). A rainbow wheel every 30 secs with a list of thousands of param 0XXX isn't very pleasing to work with if you see what I mean, and hopefully you do.

It looks like Spectrasonics (to some extent), Nomad Factory, and DC are using the same host ID system. The question is now, how can we make sure they work the same way?? In the case of Spectrasonics, it works flawlessly. In the case of magma and plug&mix Chainer, it looks like it's a bit different. Omnisphere and Trillian feature 256 automation slots for the host automation, and in most cases, it's more than enough! That's just my point here. Giving access to thousands of parameters in the automation isn't absolutely necessary in most cases, but that's an open debate.

as a workaround for too many automation parameters in logic you could try the "latch" function. pretty convenient i use it most of the time because i'm also always tired of endless lists showing up for only one plugin. BUT, i have to admit that i haven't tried latch with chainer myself yet, because the plugin itself just wouldn't work at all for me in the current version.

mac os x yosemite (latest version)
logic pro x (10.1.X - latest version)
no interface

[denka]

Now to answer the issues where some of you encounter "Installation Failed", that is most likely a "Permission" issue where the installer is not able to create all folders in the library, specially the P&M plugin folder. The first thing to do is "Repair Permissions" relaunch and re-install the chainer.

Kind Regards - Eric

Do you really think we are rookies and don't know this basic "support things for dummies 2001"?

Sorry, it failed on 3 of my Mac, 4 OSX testers partitions, etc, on all instalation failed. period.

[DaveC]

Problem: no P&M plug ins are in the Chainer menu

iMac Retina 4GHz i7
OSX Yosemite 10.10.2
ProTools 10.3.10
I own VIP Bundle and therefore Chainer.

Installs appear to work fine.
After reading other suggestions, I checked in library/application support... - the subfolder PM Plug-Ins was already there and contained 45 plug in files. All looked correct.
Authorisation for Chainer accepts the serial and says active on this computer. (I have activated after the install, and via the plugin Prefs menu, numerous times, closed restarted the plug in, closed, restarted the host)
The bottom of Chainer still says 'VST Demo'

I also cleaned permissions ran scripts etc with Onyx and reinstalled chainer, and reauthorised again many times, no difference.

After scanning, VST effects and instruments re there and appear to work fine, but there is no submenu for 'PM Plug-Ins' so I cannot add or chain any.

Help appreciated as I don't know what else to try

[rockguit]

I got the same error message after installing P&M v3.3--AAE Error -7054. All v3.3 plug-ins won't load. Earlier version (pre-Chainer) worked flawlessly.

MB Pro Retina 2.7 GHz i7, 16GB Ram
Yosemite 10.10.2
PT 11.3.1

Tried repairing permissions, rebooting, reinstalling, etc., etc. to no avail.

Please help! Thank you!

This post has been edited by rockguit: Mar 29 2015, 08:11 PM

[thesamrohdeshow]

I got the same error message after installing P&M v3.3--AAE Error -7054. All v3.3 plug-ins won't load. Earlier version (pre-Chainer) worked flawlessly.

MB Pro Retina 2.7 GHz i7, 16GB Ram
Yosemite 10.10.2
PT 11.3.1

Tried repairing permissions, rebooting, reinstalling, etc., etc. to no avail.

Please help! Thank you!

Exact same outcome for me running same Mac , OS and PT versions.
Help would be awesome.